A bunch of Ranger questions - Guild Wars Forums

DrMGinius · Mar 17, 2011, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Salutations gentlemen. I have some questions about the Ranger:

Is it viable to play a Ranger without a pet?
Is Ranger/Ritualist a good combination? And if it is, would I be able to play a damage dealer (with ranger skills) and support role (with ritualist skills) with it?
And what about a Ranger/Assasin combination to create an adventurer-like character?

That's all, thanks in advance.

Quaker · Mar 17, 2011, 03:12 PM // 15:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrMGinius

Is it viable to play a Ranger without a pet?

Yes. I mostly use a pet as a body blocker, and things would probably go just as well without it. However, I like bringing a pet, so I do.
Also, there are many Ranger builds, such as a Trapper or SoS R/Rt, that don't use a pet.
Edit - bringing a pet does not mean that you need to be a Beastmaster in any sense. Bringing a pet as a blocker only requires one skill slot, and no points in BM.

Quote:

Is Ranger/Ritualist a good combination? And if it is, would I be able to play a damage dealer (with ranger skills) and support role (with ritualist skills) with it?

A R/Rt is mostly viable as an SoS damage dealer. I would think that a Ranger/Paragon would be better for damage/support.

Quote:

And what about a Ranger/Assasin combination to create an adventurer-like character?

I don't know, and I'm too lazy to look into it, but I suspect that a Ra/A would be for those people who play GW like it's a shooter instead of an RPG.

gremlin · Mar 17, 2011, 03:33 PM // 15:33

Ranger is viable for a lot of build styles you just have to work to your strengths.

Your prime skills make you a jack of all trades.

Mid strength armour very good elemental damage resistance.
running skills so you have speed to get into and out of a fight.
Reasonable energy equip a staff or wand combo you can have enough for your ritualist skills.
Equip a shield for less energy but more defence and health or just stick with the traditional bow.

With or without a pet ranger is good in fact I reckon more people play without a pet than with as for a long time beastmaster builds were uncommon.

I have found the ranger class far more interesting to play since I stopped thinking of the class as just someone with a bow.
Ranger/assassin well yes pretty good there is one build based on the assassin skill to increase critical hit chance.
Also the Rit build to add splinter-shot and of course the old ranger/ele build to increase damage via conjure element.

Many of these work with barrage the idea being barrage removes ranger preparations so you cannot barrage fire or poison, but it doesn't remove other damage increasing skills from your secondary class.
Pick the secondary class you think works well and then change it later in the game if your experience tells you to.

Rites · Mar 17, 2011, 03:34 PM // 15:34

Rangers don't need pets

R/Rit mostly used for SoS/Channeling spirits and splinter weapon

R/A mostly used for farming builds, but a dagger ranger isnt that bad either

DrMGinius · Mar 17, 2011, 04:19 PM // 16:19

Dagger ranger? Wait a second, that means I can play ranger as a melee character?
Thank you for your support!

KIDGOOCH · Mar 17, 2011, 05:25 PM // 17:25

If you want a different type of game play try Ra/Paragon the spear makes a rather similar type of skill set but with decidedly different skills. Or if you really want a pet try R/W bunny thumper

gremlin · Mar 17, 2011, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrMGinius

Dagger ranger? Wait a second, that means I can play ranger as a melee character?
Thank you for your support!

Bow - Daggers - spear/shield - sword/shield - axe/shield - hammer - Scythe wand/focus - staff.

What you carry and fight with is determined by personal choice and by your secondary class.

Of course to make the weapon work well in combat you have to put skill points into that area which leaves fewer points to put into ranger skills.

Its something that you can change whenever you decide.

Ghull Ka · Mar 17, 2011, 09:31 PM // 21:31

My advice to you, when planning your bar:

Remember that Hexes, Enchantments and Spells aren't affected by your Expertise attribute. If you make a bar with a lot of healing or damage spells, you'll run out of energy in no time at all, and it'll suck.

So, long story short: Don't try to be a healer or a mage on your ranger. Shoot stuff instead. :-)

BrettM · Mar 18, 2011, 01:19 AM // 01:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rites

Rangers don't need pets

I would go further. Rangers should not even bring pets unless they are prepared to invest in the Beast Mastery attribute and bring pet attacks and buffs. Otherwise the skill slot taken by Comfort Animal can be used in many better ways. Without Beast Mastery attribute and skills, the pet does no noticeable damage and does not make a good meat shield because it responds too slowly and will spend most of its time running back and forth between you and the fight while the badguys ignore it.

(I love running beastmaster builds, but it is not worth doing if you don't do it right. If you hate pets, by all means leave it behind unless you're leveling it for HoM.)

gremlin · Mar 18, 2011, 01:31 AM // 01:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrettM

I would go further. Rangers should not even bring pets unless they are prepared to invest in the Beast Mastery attribute and bring pet attacks and buffs. Otherwise the skill slot taken by Comfort Animal can be used in many better ways. Without Beast Mastery attribute and skills, the pet does no noticeable damage and does not make a good meat shield because it responds too slowly and will spend most of its time running back and forth between you and the fight while the badguys ignore it.

(I love running beastmaster builds, but it is not worth doing if you don't do it right. If you hate pets, by all means leave it behind unless you're leveling it for HoM.)

Too true

Have recently learned to love running a beastmast.

I guess the perception for new players that come through presearing is if your a ranger you get a pet, its pretty much forced on you.

Also you do not have any beastmaster skills or many points anyway.
By the time you leave presearing you have a pet and your pretty much used to it, without actually learning about the importance of pet skills or points in beastmaster.

More skills and a little longer in presearing and players could have left with a better idea of how to run a character.

Probably why the isolated start area wasn't repeated for the other games.

DrMGinius · Mar 18, 2011, 05:21 AM // 05:21

Thank you all for your advice! I think I'll go Ranger/Paragon, no pet. I'll try a bow build with a few Paragon support skills, and if it doesn't work, spear/shield build, since as gremlin said I can change it whenever I decide.

Quaker · Mar 18, 2011, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrettM

I would go further. Rangers should not even bring pets unless they are prepared to invest in the Beast Mastery attribute and bring pet attacks and buffs.

If you are talking PvP, I would agree, but for PvE, I strongly disagree - for three main reasons:

1. There is almost always a skill slot open for an "optional" or less used skill. Sure, there are skills that will, theoretically, be more useful than a pet, but are you ever going to actually use them. If your Ranger build is built around Barrage, for example, you actually use only a few skills and the pet is very useful as a blocker. Plus, although the pet's damage without BM is low, it can be thought of as a constant +8, or so.

2. Never Rampage Alone.

3. Pets are nice and add to the overall "look" of a Ranger. True, if you play GW strictly as a competitive sport, you might not want a pet, but if you play GW for fun and/or the RPG aspects, then a Ranger is not complete without a pet.

Roen · Mar 18, 2011, 04:06 PM // 16:06

I don't bring a pet unless I am running a beastmaster build, in which case all/most of my skills are in the BM line.

R/Rt SoS channelling spirit spammer = easy mode.

R/A = good combo for running.

I've been playing a trapping build lately just for the lulz.

RedDog91 · Mar 18, 2011, 05:08 PM // 17:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrMGinius

Is it viable to play a Ranger without a pet?

Of course.
The pet mechanic is a great feature when used correctly, but thats not to say that Rangers are useless without a pet. The Expertise line allows Rangers to play with pretty much whichever weapon they want (with varying results, of course). At 13 Expertise, you get a 52% discount on all attack skills, which means you only pay half (a great thing being that 5e skills will be rounded down to 2e because 48% of 5 is 2.4)! Rangers also have A LOT of defensive skills. Combine this with their inherent +30 armor against elemental damage and even the most mediocre Ranger can have a decent survivability rate.

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Is Ranger/Ritualist a good combination? And if it is, would I be able to play a damage dealer (with ranger skills) and support role (with ritualist skills) with it?

Ranger/Rit is often found running a splinter/barrage build in most PvE groups. The thought process in this build is that barrage removes preparations, meaning you can't use your Ranger skills to buff your attack power. However, weapon spells aren't removed by barrage, so using splinter weapon can increase you damage output.
Ranger/Rit can also be use as an SoS. Expertise lowers the cost of binding rituals, so its not very cost heavy to bring spirits when other non-caster professions sometimes have trouble maintaining energy (note, the trouble only arises in situations where the spirits die incredibly fast, such as enemies attacking spirits instead of players).

Quote:

And what about a Ranger/Assasin combination to create an adventurer-like character?

R/A can be a good combination when you combine Expertise with daggers and defensive skills. The most common R/A builds often involve bringing a pet for extra conditions and/or damage. R/A is also a good combination for ecto farming, as a certain build can clear the first 2 groups in Tomb of Primeval Kings faster than any other build.

DrMGinius · Mar 18, 2011, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

If you are talking PvP, I would agree, but for PvE, I strongly disagree - for three main reasons:

1. There is almost always a skill slot open for an "optional" or less used skill. Sure, there are skills that will, theoretically, be more useful than a pet, but are you ever going to actually use them. If your Ranger build is built around Barrage, for example, you actually use only a few skills and the pet is very useful as a blocker. Plus, although the pet's damage without BM is low, it can be thought of as a constant +8, or so.

2. Never Rampage Alone.

3. Pets are nice and add to the overall "look" of a Ranger. True, if you play GW strictly as a competitive sport, you might not want a pet, but if you play GW for fun and/or the RPG aspects, then a Ranger is not complete without a pet.

What I don't like about the pet is precisely the "look" it adds. I don't want to be with a mangy animal following me around all the time.

RedDog91 · Mar 18, 2011, 06:02 PM // 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrMGinius

What I don't like about the pet is precisely the "look" it adds. I don't want to be with a mangy animal following me around all the time.

Well, you could take a look at this list and find which pet looks best to you.

My personal favorite is the Black Moa because it looks good with my Ancient armor that I usually wear.

BrettM · Mar 18, 2011, 07:04 PM // 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

If you are talking PvP, I would agree, but for PvE, I strongly disagree - for three main reasons:

1. Given all the PvE skills in the game, there are several that are far more useful than a pet. There's no "theoretically" about it.

A pet is not very useful as a blocker, as you claim. Pet AI does not know how to tank any more than hero AI does, and there aren't many circumstances in which the enemy AI will attack your pet in preference to you. If a foe kites, the pet will just stand there for a couple of seconds, will take seconds to catch up, and will then stand there for another 2 seconds before attacking. By which time the foe has moved again. That is not useful blocking.

Given the slow attack speed of pets, the "constant +8 or so" you suggest is highly unlikely. I took a level 20 pet at 0 BM to Master of Damage and let it autoattack. I got 5 DPS against a stationary target with AR 60. Against AR 100 that damage will be cut in half. Against a kiting target a pet would be lucky to get 1 DPS, because mostly it will not be able to attack at all. You would be far better off using that slot for a party buff (say "Go for the Eyes!"), an IAS, or anything else that will boost DPS.

2. NRO requires a second skill slot. Lightning Reflexes is usually a better choice if you aren't actually using the pet to do damage. Drunken Master is cheaper and much longer lasting, and is faster if you are drunk.

3. That's a matter of taste. Many feel that pets are not what defines a GW1 ranger.

Quaker · Mar 19, 2011, 02:48 PM // 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrettM

1. Given all the PvE skills in the game, there are several that are far more useful than a pet. There's no "theoretically" about it.

The reason why so many builds (on PvX) have "optional" skill slots is because most builds rely on only a few skills for the main mechanic. So, throwing in some other skill that is "theoretically" more useful, doesn't matter if you don't ever get to use/need it. So why not take a pet for grins? (Grins used to be a big part of the game once, and still are for some of us.

)

For example, say you're running a basic Barrage build. You have Barrage, an interrupt like Dis Shot, maybe Pain Inverter, and an IAS. That's only 4 skill slots - surely you can shoehorn a pet in there among the many choices. (Even if you add Splinter)

Quote:

2. NRO (NRA?) requires a second skill slot.

So does Lightning Reflexes or any IAS. Or more accurately - any IAS requires 1 skill slot. NRA only works if you have a pet, but pet+NRA requires no more slots than pet+Lightning Reflexes. Plus NRA gives health regen as well.

Quote:

3. That's a matter of taste. Many feel that pets are not what defines a GW1 ranger.

If you look at the history of RPGs in general, pets have always been associated with Ranger/bow-using classes. So, while "many" may not think a pet defines a Ranger, "most" do.

Miteshu · Mar 19, 2011, 02:57 PM // 14:57

If you have a rit hero, I suggest not putting splinter on your bar but instead on the SoS bar.

For varaints, use the above suggestion or go R/Mo for the Remove Hex against Decreased AS/MS.

Alathaea · Mar 19, 2011, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

If you look at the history of RPGs in general, pets have always been associated with Ranger/bow-using classes. So, while "many" may not think a pet defines a Ranger, "most" do.

Appeal to tradition = failsauce argument. And it's not even true anyway. The "Archer" class is still alive and well, without a pet. To suggest that people have to consider pets vital just because other people do is ill-judged.

Mar 17, 2011, 02:55 PM // 14:55	#1
DrMGinius Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Mar 2011	A bunch of Ranger questions Salutations gentlemen. I have some questions about the Ranger: Is it viable to play a Ranger without a pet? Is Ranger/Ritualist a good combination? And if it is, would I be able to play a damage dealer (with ranger skills) and support role (with ritualist skills) with it? And what about a Ranger/Assasin combination to create an adventurer-like character? That's all, thanks in advance.

Mar 17, 2011, 03:33 PM // 15:33	#3
gremlin Furnace Stoker Join Date: Oct 2006 Guild: GWAR Profession: Me/Mo	Ranger is viable for a lot of build styles you just have to work to your strengths. Your prime skills make you a jack of all trades. Mid strength armour very good elemental damage resistance. running skills so you have speed to get into and out of a fight. Reasonable energy equip a staff or wand combo you can have enough for your ritualist skills. Equip a shield for less energy but more defence and health or just stick with the traditional bow. With or without a pet ranger is good in fact I reckon more people play without a pet than with as for a long time beastmaster builds were uncommon. I have found the ranger class far more interesting to play since I stopped thinking of the class as just someone with a bow. Ranger/assassin well yes pretty good there is one build based on the assassin skill to increase critical hit chance. Also the Rit build to add splinter-shot and of course the old ranger/ele build to increase damage via conjure element. Many of these work with barrage the idea being barrage removes ranger preparations so you cannot barrage fire or poison, but it doesn't remove other damage increasing skills from your secondary class. Pick the secondary class you think works well and then change it later in the game if your experience tells you to. Last edited by gremlin; Mar 17, 2011 at 03:42 PM // 15:42..

Mar 17, 2011, 03:34 PM // 15:34	#4
Rites Krytan Explorer Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Deep in the belly of Texas Profession: R/	Rangers don't need pets R/Rit mostly used for SoS/Channeling spirits and splinter weapon R/A mostly used for farming builds, but a dagger ranger isnt that bad either

Mar 17, 2011, 04:19 PM // 16:19	#5
DrMGinius Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Mar 2011	Dagger ranger? Wait a second, that means I can play ranger as a melee character? Thank you for your support!

Mar 17, 2011, 05:25 PM // 17:25	#6
KIDGOOCH Krytan Explorer Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: MD Profession: R/Mo	If you want a different type of game play try Ra/Paragon the spear makes a rather similar type of skill set but with decidedly different skills. Or if you really want a pet try R/W bunny thumper

Mar 17, 2011, 09:31 PM // 21:31	#8
Ghull Ka Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Seattle, WA Guild: Grenths Helpdesk Profession: N/	My advice to you, when planning your bar: Remember that Hexes, Enchantments and Spells aren't affected by your Expertise attribute. If you make a bar with a lot of healing or damage spells, you'll run out of energy in no time at all, and it'll suck. So, long story short: Don't try to be a healer or a mage on your ranger. Shoot stuff instead. :-)

Mar 18, 2011, 05:21 AM // 05:21	#11
DrMGinius Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Mar 2011	Thank you all for your advice! I think I'll go Ranger/Paragon, no pet. I'll try a bow build with a few Paragon support skills, and if it doesn't work, spear/shield build, since as gremlin said I can change it whenever I decide.

Mar 18, 2011, 04:06 PM // 16:06	#13
Roen Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: GMT-5 Guild: [Nite] Profession: R/	I don't bring a pet unless I am running a beastmaster build, in which case all/most of my skills are in the BM line. R/Rt SoS channelling spirit spammer = easy mode. R/A = good combo for running. I've been playing a trapping build lately just for the lulz.

Mar 19, 2011, 02:57 PM // 14:57	#19
Miteshu Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Feb 2011 Profession: R/D	If you have a rit hero, I suggest not putting splinter on your bar but instead on the SoS bar. For varaints, use the above suggestion or go R/Mo for the Remove Hex against Decreased AS/MS.